The silly season is already upon us in the Big 12

Ian Boyd

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The assumption heading into the 2020 football season, affected as it has been by the COVID pandemic, has been that the normal silly season of coaching moves would be diminished. After all, these athletic departments are bleeding out huge piles of money between all the COVID testing, reduced attendance, and reductions to the other forms of revenue.

That assumption appears to have been in error.

For one, because football is the main driver of revenue for athletic departments in college football, anything that can damage that revenue stream is all the more important. Go read our Inside Scoop on how failures within the football program are leaving the University with little leverage and somewhat beholden to what the big money donors want and expect from the athletic department.

Suffice to say, Tom Herman is not in great shape. Going 2-2 in a season in which the AD shelled out huge money to make the season happen because it was year four for the head coach and the senior season for the star quarterback is no bueno. When that 2-2 start includes a miracle win on the road against a 1-3 team achieved by your star quarterback? Less great for the head coach. When the triple overtime loss in the rivalry game was on pace to be a blowout but for more heroics from that quarterback? Really bad for the head coach.

When the star quarterback is the only player on the team standing for the school song with the fans after the game?


It's a metaphor really. It makes Sam Ehlinger appear to be the only Longhorn player for whom protecting the tradition of Texas football seems to matter. Of course he isn't, but when his hero-ball is the only thing between Texas and a 1-3 start with a blowout loss to the rival in a make or break season? Not great.

Someone has to pay for the rest of Texas' stadium and facility upgrades, and it may be people who currently don't want to make that donation unless they're also giving toward a buyout of Tom Herman's contract.

Meanwhile up in Manhattan, who's athletic department is similarly damaged by COVID, they've signed Chris Klieman to a six-year extension and 150% raise. Why? Because if money problems are going to be a big issue in the wake of the pandemic than you'd better be sure that the man in charge of your biggest revenue generator is the right guy!

Finally, we get this live grenade tossed into the mix:


Look everyone, there's a reason Lincoln Riley is the favorite for that job. Jerry Jones was definitely interested in poaching the brilliant Sooner coach last year but the Dallas Cowboys gig is not ultra appealing for a college coach who's making millions, in charge of personnel evaluation, and not beholden to an over involved owner/boss who thinks he understands football as well or better than his coach. Why do y'all think the Cowboys settled on Mike McCarthy?

Meanwhile the Falcons may currently appear to be a mess of a program, but they might be an alluring NFL gig for a lot of coaches and there's been smoke before about Riley potentially being interested in that gig. Maybe this timing is bad, maybe he'll be tempted but decide to carry on at Oklahoma where he has a great thing going, or maybe he'll leave.

Maybe Texas and Oklahoma will both be in the market for new head coaches in football. It is 2020, after all.
 

Ian Boyd

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We'll take Urban and OU can have Harbaugh. Straight up. Seems fair.
I don't think Harbaugh is going anywhere. I know he needs an extension but it doesn't sound like Michigan is in particularly good shape right now to do anything but offer it and unless he's looking to get out, I think he'll sign.
I don't see the Falcons going the college coach route. The Petrino wounds are still there.
We'll see. With how things have gone with Kingsbury I think it's pretty plausible.
 
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playbookgamer

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This may be cynical on my part but I love the coaching carousel better than the games at times. It never gets old and the domino effects that come with these hires and fires are beyond fascinating.
 
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playbookgamer

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You are not alone!

The big question: who is on the shortlist besides Urban, just in case that doesn't happen? I'm having a hard time coming up with names as that job is a behemoth and needs one who can handle it. Not many coaches out there who can.
 

bHero

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The big question: who is on the shortlist besides Urban, just in case that doesn't happen? I'm having a hard time coming up with names as that job is a behemoth and needs one who can handle it. Not many coaches out there who can.
That's probably the only clear name. Texas has to come up with a lot of money to pay off Herman and potentially several assistant contracts, as well as sign a new staff. Probably a $30mm+ transition year. I'm sure there's a few others out there that might warrant the move.
 
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playbookgamer

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That's probably the only clear name. Texas has to come up with a lot of money to pay off Herman and potentially several assistant contracts, as well as sign a new staff. Probably a $30mm+ transition year. I'm sure there's a few others out there that might warrant the move.
Yeah, the timing of this is bad due to Covid and all. Texas can either go all in on a guy like Urban or go cheap, get lucky, and find the next Dabo. The problem with option #2 is the luck part as going with an unproven coach is a huge risk. I should know being a Tennessee fan.
 
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bHero

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Yeah, the timing of this is bad due to Covid and all. Texas can either go all in on a guy like Urban or go cheap, get lucky, and find the next Dabo. The problem with option #2 is the luck part as going with an unproven coach is a huge risk. I should know being a Tennessee fan.
I don't think they'll go cheap, mainly because Herman's buyout is probably $20mm alone. It wouldn't be worth it to throw $5mm at another inexperienced gamble like Tom.
 

playbookgamer

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I don't think they'll go cheap, mainly because Herman's buyout is probably $20mm alone. It wouldn't be worth it to throw $5mm at another inexperienced gamble like Tom.
It sounds like an all-or-nothing ordeal, I hope it works out for you all. I would say to finally go get Saban but it's probably too late for that. I always heard Texas/Saban could have been a thing the last few rounds, but I never knew how close that actually came to fruition.
 
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Ian Boyd

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The big question: who is on the shortlist besides Urban, just in case that doesn't happen? I'm having a hard time coming up with names as that job is a behemoth and needs one who can handle it. Not many coaches out there who can.
So Urban Meyer is the obvious one. Given that Texas really wants someone in that job who's A) as sure a bet as they can find at this point and B) exciting to fans and especially big donors, Urban is your clear favorite.

Then maybe Bob Stoops if he's interested, that seems like an awfully long shot.

Then, unless I'm not thinking of someone, you're talking about the most promising up and comers. Matt Campbell, Luke Fickell, Chris Klieman, PJ Fleck, Billy Napier. Maybe you can poach a somewhat established guy like Mario Cristobal, Bryan Harsin, or even Lane Kiffin (least probable listed but man).
 

playbookgamer

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So Urban Meyer is the obvious one. Given that Texas really wants someone in that job who's A) as sure a bet as they can find at this point and B) exciting to fans and especially big donors, Urban is your clear favorite.

Then maybe Bob Stoops if he's interested, that seems like an awfully long shot.

Then, unless I'm not thinking of someone, you're talking about the most promising up and comers. Matt Campbell, Luke Fickell, Chris Klieman, PJ Fleck, Billy Napier. Maybe you can poach a somewhat established guy like Mario Cristobal, Bryan Harsin, or even Lane Kiffin (least probable listed but man).
All good names there for various reasons. Did Harsin leave on good terms? He was on the tail-end of Brown's tenure, correct?
 

bHero

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It sounds like an all-or-nothing ordeal, I hope it works out for you all. I would say to finally go get Saban but it's probably too late for that. I always heard Texas/Saban could have been a thing the last few rounds, but I never knew how close that actually came to fruition.
It was pretty damn close.

The real hysteria began in early November when The Associated Press obtained an email written by Tom Hicks about the Sexton call. One sentence in the email stood out: “Sexton confirmed that UT is the only job Nick would possibly consider leaving Alabama for, and that his success there created special pressure for him.”
 
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DuvalHorn

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Yeah, the timing of this is bad due to Covid and all. Texas can either go all in on a guy like Urban or go cheap, get lucky, and find the next Dabo. The problem with option #2 is the luck part as going with an unproven coach is a huge risk. I should know being a Tennessee fan.
How does a Tennessee fan end up on a board like this? Love to have the outsider perspective, of course.
 

melodicmarc

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Im a huge Falcons fan and a huge OU fan. I definitely dont see Riley leaving. He seems extremely committed to OU and Norman and I think he wants to leave a legacy there. Everything he has said or done has hinted at him wanting to stay at OU. That being said, his biggest mentor is Bob Stoops, and if you read Bob Stoops' book, he states the biggest factor in whether a job is good or not is leadership at the very top. Atlanta has that in Arthur Blank. But as a fan of both squads, I'd much rather Lincoln stay at OU, and that's what I think will happen. I also think Lincoln is the best nfl head coach candidate. But we need him at OU.
 
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sherf1

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Doubt Lincoln looks at this roster coming back. With the talen and possible 5-6 5* likely to land and not want to stay.
This will also be his worst season to date as college HC, so he would be selling low on himself. Given a fairly young team that can be expected to grow significantly next year, I would bet he would want to go out on a high if nothing else to have maximum leverage.
 
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ripharley

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I don't know if he loved Texas either because it's so political and people are always floating around.
I’ve wondered more than once if the appeal of the HC position in Austin is overstated and not just by us, the understandably myopic fanbase. Up until the past few weeks I thought that CDC could be the remedy to years of uneven results in the major sports, and he still may be. But he’s been dealt a tough hand to play in 2020.
 
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Ian Boyd

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Doubt Lincoln looks at this roster coming back. With the talen and possible 5-6 5* likely to land and not want to stay.
This will also be his worst season to date as college HC, so he would be selling low on himself. Given a fairly young team that can be expected to grow significantly next year, I would bet he would want to go out on a high if nothing else to have maximum leverage.
I've always thought that Lincoln would wait until winning it all at the college level before making the jump.
All of these points are solid. His listed as the most likely next head coach but staying is more likely.
I’ve wondered more than once if the appeal of the HC position in Austin is overstated and not just by us, the understandably myopic fanbase. Up until the past few weeks I thought that CDC could be the remedy to years of uneven results in the major sports, and he still may be. But he’s been dealt a tough hand to play in 2020.
It’s not for everyone and it won’t be appealing for everyone. You get a sweet life, tons of money, and National championship resources though.
 
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ripharley

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It’s not for everyone and it won’t be appealing for everyone. You get a sweet life, tons of money, and National championship resources though.
I’ve no idea if the intensity of politics that permeates Texas athletics has its equal on other campuses, but I doubt any exceed ours. It may be the case that in this aspect at least we are indeed the Joneses.

I wonder how long UM would last.
 

clayinva

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I’ve no idea if the intensity of politics that permeates Texas athletics has its equal on other campuses, but I doubt any exceed ours. It may be the case that in this aspect at least we are indeed the Joneses.

I wonder how long UM would last.
Do you care if he hangs it up after five or six years? With his track record you'd be playoff relevant by year 2 or 3 and would have lined up a natural successor by year 5. You just need to be sure the replacement is a Whittingham or Day and not a Muschamp.
 

ripharley

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Do you care if he hangs it up after five or six years? With his track record you'd be playoff relevant by year 2 or 3 and would have lined up a natural successor by year 5. You just need to be sure the replacement is a Whittingham or Day and not a Muschamp.
Apologies if your question is rhetorical; no, I’d think that 5 or 6 in the saddle would be a successful hire.

Hiring, at any level, is always a bit of a crapshoot and at the moment UM is low-hanging fruit. He may be the best possible option, I don’t know, but CDC may have a different leader. Despite the chaos since early in the year, I’d be surprised if he hasn’t prepared for a switch.
 

kevinbelt

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I'm an Ohio State alumnus. I started reading Ian on SBNation and followed him to his own blog, then here. Finally registered after lurking for a bit because I love this kind of stuff almost as much as I love the Xs and Os stuff. Thoughts on a couple of names mentioned:

Urban Meyer: This actually doesn't sound terribly unrealistic to me. I've said from the minute he announced his retirement that he'll coach again. I actually have a standing bet with my father-in-law (Notre Dame alum) that he takes the USC job whenever Clay Helton finally gets fired. USC is dragging their feet on that, though, and Texas is probably a better job. Herman being a former Meyer assistant, the transition wouldn't be that difficult, and even so Meyer has a track record of quick turnarounds. The idea of him coaching for five years and then turning it over to a handpicked successor is likely - it's what we all thought he'd do at OSU from the beginning; just took a few seasons longer than expected. It would be good for your program, even though I don't like him all that much. I guess the big question for me is how his relationship (or lack thereof) with Herman affects it. I can't imagine, as competitive as he is, that he wants anything to do with anything related to Tom Herman at this point. Alternatively, maybe taking Herman's place and succeeding where Herman failed is the kind of revenge that would motivate him. I can't say.

All that said, every fan base thinks they're going to get Urban Meyer. My father-in-law has been clamoring for years for ND to drop Brian Kelly, but I always ask him who he thinks would do a better job. Urban Liar, he cheerfully replies. I've had the same conversation with other ND fans as well. If he actually signals an interest in coaching again, they'll open up the bank for him. Like I said, USC is definitely at play. You'll have competition if you go after him, so it's smart to have a backup plan.

Matt Campbell: I've heard a lot about him too. He's from Ohio, so until Ryan Day was named successor, he was one of the hot names to replace Urban. But whenever anyone on OSU boards brings him up, everyone else reminds him that he's been pretty inconsistent, which is true. Some of that is due to just being Iowa State, but he still loses winnable games (like their opener this year) often enough that I'm skeptical of turning over a major program to him yet. I think he's a good coach, but at Texas he'd just be Tom Herman all over again. Why pay a $20m buyout to hire the same guy?

Luke Fickell: One of my all-time favorite football people, as a player and as a coach. But I'd be shocked if he had any interest in coaching Texas. Honestly, I'm a little shocked he's interested in coaching Cincinnati, and I think he was probably nudged a little to do that. When Michigan State fired Dantonio, they set the table for him, and he still turned them down. He was an assistant under Dantonio, and the MSU staff was already filled on both sides of the ball with coaches he'd worked with before. It was a turnkey operation for him. It's hard to see him leaving Cincinnati unless the OSU job opens up again.

PJ Fleck: I like him, but if I were running a big program I'd want to see what he does at Minnesota for another year or two before I'm ready to hand him big money. He's a rah-rah guy, and sometimes those guys can turn a bad program around just by getting them to work harder. I want to see him sustain that success, and recruit at a high level, before I'd give him Texas. Again, I think this is part of the problem you're running into with Herman: he had some early success at UH and got hot, and you jumped at him before you really knew what you were getting.

Billy Napier: Probably the most likely guy to get a bigger job this offseason. Certainly has the pedigree. Not the worst idea.

I’ve wondered more than once if the appeal of the HC position in Austin is overstated
Yes, but that's true of all big programs. It's a conundrum: for the most part, the kind of people that want the job are the kind of people you don't want to hire. E.g., Tom Herman. The people you'd prefer to hire (e.g., Urban Meyer, Nick Saban) are generally looking for reasons not to take it. Texas is unique in some ways, but this is true of OSU, Notre Dame, Oklahoma, any big program with a lot of history and booster interest. The reason Meyer went to OSU and Saban went to Alabama is because those ADs cleared out the BS so that they could run the program their way. Unless you can do that, you're going to end up with guys like Herman who are just happy to have the job. I get the sense you did that with Mack Brown, but I also get the sense that Mack was maybe a little more comfortable being in the middle of all that than most coaches.

Anyway, I hope you beat Oklahoma next year (or in the Big XII championship game), and if you ever play A&M again, I hope you beat them as well!
 

playbookgamer

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I'm an Ohio State alumnus. I started reading Ian on SBNation and followed him to his own blog, then here. Finally registered after lurking for a bit because I love this kind of stuff almost as much as I love the Xs and Os stuff. Thoughts on a couple of names mentioned:

Urban Meyer: This actually doesn't sound terribly unrealistic to me. I've said from the minute he announced his retirement that he'll coach again. I actually have a standing bet with my father-in-law (Notre Dame alum) that he takes the USC job whenever Clay Helton finally gets fired. USC is dragging their feet on that, though, and Texas is probably a better job. Herman being a former Meyer assistant, the transition wouldn't be that difficult, and even so Meyer has a track record of quick turnarounds. The idea of him coaching for five years and then turning it over to a handpicked successor is likely - it's what we all thought he'd do at OSU from the beginning; just took a few seasons longer than expected. It would be good for your program, even though I don't like him all that much. I guess the big question for me is how his relationship (or lack thereof) with Herman affects it. I can't imagine, as competitive as he is, that he wants anything to do with anything related to Tom Herman at this point. Alternatively, maybe taking Herman's place and succeeding where Herman failed is the kind of revenge that would motivate him. I can't say.

All that said, every fan base thinks they're going to get Urban Meyer. My father-in-law has been clamoring for years for ND to drop Brian Kelly, but I always ask him who he thinks would do a better job. Urban Liar, he cheerfully replies. I've had the same conversation with other ND fans as well. If he actually signals an interest in coaching again, they'll open up the bank for him. Like I said, USC is definitely at play. You'll have competition if you go after him, so it's smart to have a backup plan.

Matt Campbell: I've heard a lot about him too. He's from Ohio, so until Ryan Day was named successor, he was one of the hot names to replace Urban. But whenever anyone on OSU boards brings him up, everyone else reminds him that he's been pretty inconsistent, which is true. Some of that is due to just being Iowa State, but he still loses winnable games (like their opener this year) often enough that I'm skeptical of turning over a major program to him yet. I think he's a good coach, but at Texas he'd just be Tom Herman all over again. Why pay a $20m buyout to hire the same guy?

Luke Fickell: One of my all-time favorite football people, as a player and as a coach. But I'd be shocked if he had any interest in coaching Texas. Honestly, I'm a little shocked he's interested in coaching Cincinnati, and I think he was probably nudged a little to do that. When Michigan State fired Dantonio, they set the table for him, and he still turned them down. He was an assistant under Dantonio, and the MSU staff was already filled on both sides of the ball with coaches he'd worked with before. It was a turnkey operation for him. It's hard to see him leaving Cincinnati unless the OSU job opens up again.

PJ Fleck: I like him, but if I were running a big program I'd want to see what he does at Minnesota for another year or two before I'm ready to hand him big money. He's a rah-rah guy, and sometimes those guys can turn a bad program around just by getting them to work harder. I want to see him sustain that success, and recruit at a high level, before I'd give him Texas. Again, I think this is part of the problem you're running into with Herman: he had some early success at UH and got hot, and you jumped at him before you really knew what you were getting.

Billy Napier: Probably the most likely guy to get a bigger job this offseason. Certainly has the pedigree. Not the worst idea.



Yes, but that's true of all big programs. It's a conundrum: for the most part, the kind of people that want the job are the kind of people you don't want to hire. E.g., Tom Herman. The people you'd prefer to hire (e.g., Urban Meyer, Nick Saban) are generally looking for reasons not to take it. Texas is unique in some ways, but this is true of OSU, Notre Dame, Oklahoma, any big program with a lot of history and booster interest. The reason Meyer went to OSU and Saban went to Alabama is because those ADs cleared out the BS so that they could run the program their way. Unless you can do that, you're going to end up with guys like Herman who are just happy to have the job. I get the sense you did that with Mack Brown, but I also get the sense that Mack was maybe a little more comfortable being in the middle of all that than most coaches.

Anyway, I hope you beat Oklahoma next year (or in the Big XII championship game), and if you ever play A&M again, I hope you beat them as well!
PJ Fleck reminds me of Butch Jones, but Fleck seems to know what he's doing. As a Vol fan, I put up with Butch's rah-rah nonsense for five years. It's tolerable when you win but unbearable when you lose. If Fleck has another solid year then I can see him as a legit candidate.
 

ripharley

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I'm an Ohio State alumnus. I started reading Ian on SBNation and followed him to his own blog, then here. Finally registered after lurking for a bit because I love this kind of stuff almost as much as I love the Xs and Os stuff. Thoughts on a couple of names mentioned:

Urban Meyer: This actually doesn't sound terribly unrealistic to me. I've said from the minute he announced his retirement that he'll coach again. I actually have a standing bet with my father-in-law (Notre Dame alum) that he takes the USC job whenever Clay Helton finally gets fired. USC is dragging their feet on that, though, and Texas is probably a better job. Herman being a former Meyer assistant, the transition wouldn't be that difficult, and even so Meyer has a track record of quick turnarounds. The idea of him coaching for five years and then turning it over to a handpicked successor is likely - it's what we all thought he'd do at OSU from the beginning; just took a few seasons longer than expected. It would be good for your program, even though I don't like him all that much. I guess the big question for me is how his relationship (or lack thereof) with Herman affects it. I can't imagine, as competitive as he is, that he wants anything to do with anything related to Tom Herman at this point. Alternatively, maybe taking Herman's place and succeeding where Herman failed is the kind of revenge that would motivate him. I can't say.

All that said, every fan base thinks they're going to get Urban Meyer. My father-in-law has been clamoring for years for ND to drop Brian Kelly, but I always ask him who he thinks would do a better job. Urban Liar, he cheerfully replies. I've had the same conversation with other ND fans as well. If he actually signals an interest in coaching again, they'll open up the bank for him. Like I said, USC is definitely at play. You'll have competition if you go after him, so it's smart to have a backup plan.

Matt Campbell: I've heard a lot about him too. He's from Ohio, so until Ryan Day was named successor, he was one of the hot names to replace Urban. But whenever anyone on OSU boards brings him up, everyone else reminds him that he's been pretty inconsistent, which is true. Some of that is due to just being Iowa State, but he still loses winnable games (like their opener this year) often enough that I'm skeptical of turning over a major program to him yet. I think he's a good coach, but at Texas he'd just be Tom Herman all over again. Why pay a $20m buyout to hire the same guy?

Luke Fickell: One of my all-time favorite football people, as a player and as a coach. But I'd be shocked if he had any interest in coaching Texas. Honestly, I'm a little shocked he's interested in coaching Cincinnati, and I think he was probably nudged a little to do that. When Michigan State fired Dantonio, they set the table for him, and he still turned them down. He was an assistant under Dantonio, and the MSU staff was already filled on both sides of the ball with coaches he'd worked with before. It was a turnkey operation for him. It's hard to see him leaving Cincinnati unless the OSU job opens up again.

PJ Fleck: I like him, but if I were running a big program I'd want to see what he does at Minnesota for another year or two before I'm ready to hand him big money. He's a rah-rah guy, and sometimes those guys can turn a bad program around just by getting them to work harder. I want to see him sustain that success, and recruit at a high level, before I'd give him Texas. Again, I think this is part of the problem you're running into with Herman: he had some early success at UH and got hot, and you jumped at him before you really knew what you were getting.

Billy Napier: Probably the most likely guy to get a bigger job this offseason. Certainly has the pedigree. Not the worst idea.



Yes, but that's true of all big programs. It's a conundrum: for the most part, the kind of people that want the job are the kind of people you don't want to hire. E.g., Tom Herman. The people you'd prefer to hire (e.g., Urban Meyer, Nick Saban) are generally looking for reasons not to take it. Texas is unique in some ways, but this is true of OSU, Notre Dame, Oklahoma, any big program with a lot of history and booster interest. The reason Meyer went to OSU and Saban went to Alabama is because those ADs cleared out the BS so that they could run the program their way. Unless you can do that, you're going to end up with guys like Herman who are just happy to have the job. I get the sense you did that with Mack Brown, but I also get the sense that Mack was maybe a little more comfortable being in the middle of all that than most coaches.

Anyway, I hope you beat Oklahoma next year (or in the Big XII championship game), and if you ever play A&M again, I hope you beat them as well!
Interesting and well-written, welcome to the fray.

Among the fan base has approval of Ryan Day reached the level of Meyer?
 

Ian Boyd

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Really good to see you on here, Kevin! Lotta nuggets in that post that were insightful.
Matt Campbell: I've heard a lot about him too. He's from Ohio, so until Ryan Day was named successor, he was one of the hot names to replace Urban. But whenever anyone on OSU boards brings him up, everyone else reminds him that he's been pretty inconsistent, which is true. Some of that is due to just being Iowa State, but he still loses winnable games (like their opener this year) often enough that I'm skeptical of turning over a major program to him yet. I think he's a good coach, but at Texas he'd just be Tom Herman all over again. Why pay a $20m buyout to hire the same guy?
I do think Matt Campbell is much better at a couple of important things than Tom Herman.

For instance, finding and featuring talent:
Year 1 key player: Allen Lazard. 69 catches, 1018 yards, 7 TDs. Moved him around from outside to slot. QB? Park and others
Year 2 key player: David Montgomery. 258 carries, 1146 yards, 11 TDs. QB? Kyle Kempt
Year 3 key player: Hakeem Butler: 60 catches, 1318 yards, 9 TDs. Outside receiver. QB? Brock Purdy
Year 4 key player: Deshaunte Jones. 76 catches, 877 yards, 2 TDs. Slot receiver. QB? Brock Purdy
Year 5 key player: Breece Hall: 93 carries for 531 yards, 8 TDs. QB? Brock Purdy

Those are five pretty different players he's been able to adjust his offense to maximize. Tom Herman's best skill player has always just been whoever plays in the slot.

Second thing Campbell seems to do better than Herman, run the freaking ball. Despite having nowhere near the same caliber of recruits, especially on the OL, he always seems to be better at opening holes for running backs that are unquestionably more talented than the Texas kids. David Montgomery and Breece Hall both start at Texas any year in the last 10.

Tom Herman ran Houston for two years and rode Greg Ward Jr to success without otherwise running the ball terribly well. Matt Campbell certainly didn't inherit much more talent than Herman found at Houston and he's adapted and replenished his skill talent on the roster for five years now while facing much tougher competition.

All that to say, it wouldn't be shocking if Campbell was significantly more effective than Herman.
 

kevinbelt

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Interesting and well-written, welcome to the fray.

Among the fan base has approval of Ryan Day reached the level of Meyer?
Thank you, and yes. Personally, I was never a huge fan of Meyer to begin with - he's got an insincerity about him that I find hard to take. Day has continued the good parts of the Meyer regime while dropping some of the negatives. In particular, he's recruiting Ohio hard again. Meyer recruited nationally, which worked when we got guys like Zeke Elliott, the Bosas, and Dwayne Haskins. But the thing about Ohio is that every other Big Ten school recruits Ohio hard, and if we're not taking 3 star Ohioans, someone else will. This is how Bo Schembecler built the Michigan program (Desmond Howard and Charles Woodson are both Ohioans), and why Michigan fell off when Jim Tressel locked down Ohio. It's also how Michigan State suddenly got good at the end of the Tressel era. I think Day is balancing well - getting top national guys while also keeping a lot of guys in-state.

Also, I'm a little biased because I live in New Hampshire now, and I've met a few people who know him.
 

kevinbelt

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Really good to see you on here, Kevin! Lotta nuggets in that post that were insightful.

I do think Matt Campbell is much better at a couple of important things than Tom Herman.

For instance, finding and featuring talent:
Thanks Ian! High praise coming from you.

I guess my question is, is Herman calling his own plays at UT? Because when he was OC at Ohio State, he did a pretty good job at finding talent (he was the one who brought JT Barrett to Columbus), and a fair job at spreading touches around. 2014 was one of the most dynamic offenses OSU has ever seen, that famously won a championship with a third-string QB. From Braxton Miller to Barrett to Cardale Jones, from Carlos Hyde to Zeke, from Devin Smith to Jalin Marshall to Mike Thomas, it seemed like you could just plug guys into the Meyer/Herman offense. And then when Herman left for UH, our offense cratered and didn't recover until Day was hired.

The co-OC in the interim was Tim Beck, and I'm inclined to view him as the root of a lot of Texas's problems just as he was the root of ours. In 2015, we returned 9 starters on offense, including Zeke and Mike Thomas, and our total offense declined by 70 yards/game. JT Barrett, who finished fifth in the 2014 Heisman voting, developed so little that people were openly calling for him to be benched his last two years. In particular, the Beck OSU offenses leaned heavily on QB runs, even though we had the best running back in program history in 2015 and a QB who was, pre-Beck, more of a quick passer than a Tebow-style fullback. When I've watched Texas the past few years, they've looked more like the 2015 and 2016 OSU offenses than when Herman was OC.

I might be wrong, but from a distance, I would put more of the blame on Beck than Herman. Beck has been horrible pretty much everywhere he's ever been - remember Taylor Martinez as a freshman vs. Taylor Martinez as a senior? His only real success ever was taking a 5'7" QB to an Orange Bowl, and even in retrospect, that looks more like Reesing being the first of the good Lake Travis QBs who just got overlooked because of his height. I guess this year will be a test. I don't really have an opinion on Mike Yurcich, he was only our OC for one year and it was Day's offense, but I'm afraid Beck already ruined Sam Ehlinger the way he ruined Barrett and Martinez.
 

Ian Boyd

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Thanks Ian! High praise coming from you.

I guess my question is, is Herman calling his own plays at UT? Because when he was OC at Ohio State, he did a pretty good job at finding talent (he was the one who brought JT Barrett to Columbus), and a fair job at spreading touches around. 2014 was one of the most dynamic offenses OSU has ever seen, that famously won a championship with a third-string QB. From Braxton Miller to Barrett to Cardale Jones, from Carlos Hyde to Zeke, from Devin Smith to Jalin Marshall to Mike Thomas, it seemed like you could just plug guys into the Meyer/Herman offense. And then when Herman left for UH, our offense cratered and didn't recover until Day was hired.

The co-OC in the interim was Tim Beck, and I'm inclined to view him as the root of a lot of Texas's problems just as he was the root of ours. In 2015, we returned 9 starters on offense, including Zeke and Mike Thomas, and our total offense declined by 70 yards/game. JT Barrett, who finished fifth in the 2014 Heisman voting, developed so little that people were openly calling for him to be benched his last two years. In particular, the Beck OSU offenses leaned heavily on QB runs, even though we had the best running back in program history in 2015 and a QB who was, pre-Beck, more of a quick passer than a Tebow-style fullback. When I've watched Texas the past few years, they've looked more like the 2015 and 2016 OSU offenses than when Herman was OC.

I might be wrong, but from a distance, I would put more of the blame on Beck than Herman. Beck has been horrible pretty much everywhere he's ever been - remember Taylor Martinez as a freshman vs. Taylor Martinez as a senior? His only real success ever was taking a 5'7" QB to an Orange Bowl, and even in retrospect, that looks more like Reesing being the first of the good Lake Travis QBs who just got overlooked because of his height. I guess this year will be a test. I don't really have an opinion on Mike Yurcich, he was only our OC for one year and it was Day's offense, but I'm afraid Beck already ruined Sam Ehlinger the way he ruined Barrett and Martinez.
Tom Herman has run the show for most of his time at Texas, including play-calling.
 
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bouree

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I see the annual "Lincoln Riley is Leaving OU" wishful thinking narrative is in full bloom amongst the masses. As usual, it follows right after he outcoaches Tom Herman in Dallas.
 
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